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Q and A with Rear Adm. (Ret.) Stephen H. Baker, USN, Senior Fellow, CDI
 
Last updated Oct. 12, 2001 Printer-Friendly Version

Q. What do you think about the campaign strategy of the air attacks in Afghanistan over the last five days?

A. Standard procedure. Initially, the main goal has been air supremacy (which we now have), eliminating the fixed target, surface-to-air or air-to-air threat to our forces. This is intended to set the stage for future anti-terror operations and to make the airspace over Afghanistan safe for ongoing airdrops of foodstuffs to Afghan refugees. Military runways, aircraft, surface-to-air missiles, airports and terror training camps were the main targets. Follow-on phases of air strikes will be to identify mobile radar-emitting weapons and other "pop-up" targets of opportunity and destroy them.

Additionally, the air strikes on the Taliban greatly improve the ability of the opposition Northern Alliance to wage war on the ground. The Northern Alliance will likely press the attack on Mazar-e-Sharif as they move towards Kabul and outside the city. This is a shoot-look-shoot strategy to observe any movements after the strikes and react accordingly. Bomb Damage Assessments (BDA) along with fresh intelligence updates will dictate the intensity and the duration of this phase of the air campaign. We are shaking the cage pretty hard and watching to see what moves around.

A shift of target priorities will now lean towards the Taliban fighters and any al Qaeda leadership locations, including caves. Expect cluster munitions and GBU-28 "Bunker-Buster" weapons to be used.

Q. We are dropping bombs, and at the same time food and medicine packages in Afghanistan. We've never really done this before. How can we be sure supplies aren't falling into the wrong hands?

A. This is a two-front war in which humanitarian aid will be used to help counter the anti-American protests and propaganda of the Islamic fundamentalist world. In coordination/deconfliction with the bombing, Air Force C-17 cargo planes have dropped thousands of "culturally neutral," vitamin-fortified packets, each stamped with the American flag and the words: THIS FOOD IS A GIFT FROM THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. On Oct. 11 at the State Department, U.S. President George W. Bush announced that he would send an additional $320 million worth of food and medicine to the region. "This is our way of saying that while we firmly and strongly oppose the Taliban regime, we are friends of the Afghan people," he said. "We have made it clear to the world that we will stand strong on the side of good, and we expect other nations to join us." It is part of our psychological warfare (Psy Ops) in Afghanistan. The drop sites were very specifically selected to ensure the majority of these supplies reached the right people. The progress and success of these drops are being closely monitored and our tactics of ensuring aid (admittedly limited) reaches the starving refugees to the best of our ability. The drops are expected to include messages explaining U.S. actions, and encouraging people to abandon the Taliban and turn in Osama bin Laden. Another important point here is that we have created safe havens for defectors of the Taliban, and defections are happening. Many of the opposition were told by the Taliban leadership at the initial onslaught of strikes that communications would be cut off and they were on their own to survive and fight. As the Taliban regime unravels and defectors come forward, the potential of gaining critical information concerning positions/locations of other high value targets, including the whereabouts of the al Qaeda leadership increase as well.

Q. What about psychological warfare, is this important in our current operations?

A. Yes, Psy Ops will be exploited to our advantage as much as we possibly can. Radio broadcasts and leaflet dropping (and transistor radios) are some of the tools at work. We want to wear down the opposition and ensure they are fatigued, under constant tension, nervous and de-moralized. Strikes now are unpredictable and will occur at any time day or night. Reconnaissance and surveillance from satellites to UAVs to Special Forces on the ground is occurring around the clock. Anything that moves is being evaluated as a potential target that can be struck. At the same time, we will continue to put out the word that the coalition forces are overwhelming any and all opposition, that defectors will be safe and fed, that fighting is useless, and defeat and death are inevitable to those that oppose us.

Q. Most of the "high value" targets have been destroyed and aircraft are returning with unexpended ordnance. What's next?

A. We will NOT see a full-scale conventional ground attack on Afghanistan. The next phase is an ad hoc approach to an unconventional war. We are seeing a movement of ground troops intended to reinforce the message that the U.S. government is determined to carry out a long-term, wide-ranging campaign against terrorism. The Army's 10th Mountain Division ensures maximum flexibility as options unfold in the days ahead. The major role-played by these ground troops would be "force protection" — that is, missions such as providing search and rescue assets and perimeter security for the Special Force units in Uzbekistan and Pakistan. As intelligence comes in, quick search and destroy missions by Special Forces on Taliban and al Qaeda leaders is a likely scenario. Commandos will most likely be inserted by specially configured helicopters (MH-60G Pave Hawk/ MH-53J Pave Low III). We have to use these elite forces if we are going to be successful in eliminating the terrorists in Afghanistan. They will be in harms way more so than any of our other forces, and there is certainly potential for casualties. This is the mission they have trained for all their professional lives and now they will be cleared to execute. Expect British and French Special Forces as well.

Q. Searching for Osama bin Laden has been compared to searching for one rabbit in West Virginia. Do you think we will ever find him?

A. As elusive and challenging as that task seems, yes, I do. Our latest set of targets now includes the leadership of al Qaeda and the Taliban. We will bring all of our state-of-the-art reconnaissance and surveillance assets to bear. AC-130 SPECTRE and SPOOKY gun ships have infrared detection systems that have tremendous capabilities. Expect our high-tech Orion EP-3s to work with special RAF Canberras and Nimrods to combine forces in Afghanistan to provide a never-before-realized sophisticated network of 24-hour ISR (Intelligence Surveillance and Reconnaissance) operations. Human intelligence, on the ground, at the scene, in the form of Special Forces or local tribesmen working for the coalition forces will guide the crosshairs of our commando raids. They will be linked to an intelligence network ranging from our satellites, to our UAVs to our airborne command posts as we continue to root out terrorists. Keep in mind that the White House has recently said "this is really not about Osama bin Laden." The administration wants to emphasize the breadth of its anti-terrorist goals, and try to avoid defining success as the capture of one man. It is just a matter of time before we find and bring to justice the terrorists in Afghanistan. It takes patience and determination, and currently we have both.

Q. There are reports of civilian casualties that continue to grow. Is collateral damage something our pilots care about?

A. I think our forces are keenly sensitive to collateral damage — more so than any other country. All strikes have been specifically focused on the military opposition. There have been numerous occasions when the current rules of engagement required our pilots to visually confirm the intended target before dropping ordnance. In Desert Storm nine percent of weapons expended were PGM's, in the Kosovo conflict that figure rose to seventy percent, and as of today over 90 per cent of the ordnance dropped in Afghanistan have been precision-guided munitions with an advertised accuracy inside of six meters. We are hitting what we are aiming for.

We have used "dumb bombs" — MK-82 glide bombs and cluster munitions which are less accurate — on large areas such as training camps and dispersed troops.

As someone who did mission planning during the Persian Gulf War, I know the kind of detailed work that takes place before each strike in order to match the optimum ordnance with each specific target set. Target planners look at the surrounding area in great detail and always take into consideration the potential for collateral damage. While the loss of innocent lives is inevitable in this type of war, a considerable effort to avoid such incidents remains paramount in our planning.

I think it is guaranteed that such organizations as the Afghan Islamic Press would report civilian casualties. These figures can never be confirmed or substantiated by anyone outside of Afghanistan. This is a private news agency sympathetic to the Taliban, and they and others want to portray this conflict as an attack on all Muslims by the United States. This is an example of the propaganda effort underway to reach out for support in fellow Muslim countries. Civilian casualties will continue to happen, the numbers will be embellished, and we will continue to try to keep the losses to a minimum.

Interview with Rear Adm. (Ret.) Stephen H. Baker, USN
CDI Senior Fellow
former Chief of Staff for Naval Forces,
U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM), in Manama, Bahrain, and former Chief of Staff for Operations and Plans for the
USS Theodore Roosevelt battle group
sbaker@cdi.org
Printer-Friendly Version

 

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